England (Youth) Football

[road2ruin]

England U20’s won this years U20 WC beating the likes of Italy and Mexico along the way before stuffing Argentina 3-0 in the final.

England U19’s win this year’s U19 Euro’s beating Portugal in the final

England U17’s have today dispatched Brazil 3-1 to reach the final of the U17’s WC where they will play Spain or Mali.

Begs the question of how we are (presently) so competitive at the highest level at the youth sides but fail so miserably at senior level. Whilst I appreciate that there will be the foreign player element meaning greater competition for places within the English leagues but given the success wouldn’t you think that foreign club sides would look at the opportunity to grab young talent and develop it for their own gain (at club level)?

An example would be Jadon Sancho moving from Man City to Dortmund as he was concerned about the lack of playing time he was likely to get at City. Maybe this move will pave the way for others to do the same?

 

[IanM]

...then they rot in the reserves and go on loan to Walsall/Doncaster or Aldershot as Premiership foreign managers import foreign players............some of whom are excellent and many of whom are no better than the young Brits!

How long before the Chinese buy out Sky and the whole Circus goes to China?

 

[Piece]

If you look at all the youngster age groups, you will see a marked difference in how they play football compared to the U21s and the senior side. They are comfortable on the ball, well structured and don't rely on aimless punts up field. Admittedly at that age group they aren't as physically developed, thus aren't too strong or mobile as their adult counterparts, so there is more gaps and time on the ball.

Today, the U17s were better than the Brazilians, who had only conceded two goals. Also, this same team only just lost the Euro finals to Spain on penalties in May this year.

We do have the future talent compared with the rest. It's that bridge to senior level we need to cross. Perhaps look at the management and coaching at club and country level

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Because a lot of the youngsters that play in these age groups don’t have a clear transition path to first team football at their clubs or in the international team

Top teams are afraid to give youngsters a go - they prefer to spend millions in the hope the player is an instant success.

Outside England it’s a different.ball game

Clubs all over Europe have no fear putting the kids in and a lot of times they work out - the same with international teams.

Really glad that players like AA , Gomez , woodburn and Solanke are going to get a lot of chances for us

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Because a lot of the youngsters that play in these age groups don’t have a clear transition path to first team football at their clubs or in the international team

Top teams are afraid to give youngsters a go - they prefer to spend millions in the hope the player is an instant success.

Outside England it’s a different.ball game

Clubs all over Europe have no fear putting the kids in and a lot of times they work out - the same with international teams.

Really glad that players like AA , Gomez , woodburn and Solanke are going to get a lot of chances for us

You only produced 2 of them and bought the other 2 for millions, you have about 7-8 Youth players out on loan, how are Lpool any different to every other PL club.

 

[Dasit]

Why do you say we fail so miserably at top end? Media controls the minds of everybody


We reach almost every major summer tournament.

Often get to last 16 or last 8.


Not really a failure, we are playing against every other great team in the world, only 1 can win each time.



Every country thinks their own country under performs etc

 

[Tashyboy]

England U20’s won this years U20 WC beating the likes of Italy and Mexico along the way before stuffing Argentina 3-0 in the final.

England U19’s win this year’s U19 Euro’s beating Portugal in the final

England U17’s have today dispatched Brazil 3-1 to reach the final of the U17’s WC where they will play Spain or Mali.

Begs the question of how we are (presently) so competitive at the highest level at the youth sides but fail so miserably at senior level. Whilst I appreciate that there will be the foreign player element meaning greater competition for places within the English leagues but given the success wouldn’t you think that foreign club sides would look at the opportunity to grab young talent and develop it for their own gain (at club level)?

An example would be Jadon Sancho moving from Man City to Dortmund as he was concerned about the lack of playing time he was likely to get at City. Maybe this move will pave the way for others to do the same?

I mentioned Sancho in a previous thread. It got a bit naughty where he is concerned, but re the rest of your thread I have been saying the same for ages.
Stones, Walker, Sterling and Delph are playing excellent football for City. The arguement is that they are playing with better players. Are they? No one is gonna convince me that Kane, Alli, Rose, Cahill, Rashford and Lallana are rubbish.
that team gives you

Walker, Stones, Cahill, Rose
Sterling, Alli, Lallana,
Rashford , Kane.

drop in a keeper and a left winger and there's a good team. So why is it going tits up. The manager of the national team is not up to the standard of The club managers .

 

[Papas1982]

I mentioned Sancho in a previous thread. It got a bit naughty where he is concerned, but re the rest of your thread I have been saying the same for ages.
Stones, Walker, Sterling and Delph are playing excellent football for City. The arguement is that they are playing with better players. Are they? No one is gonna convince me that Kane, Alli, Rose, Cahill, Rashford and Lallana are rubbish.
that team gives you

Walker, Stones, Cahill, Rose
Sterling, Alli, Lallana,
Rashford , Kane.

drop in a keeper and a left winger and there's a good team. So why is it going tits up. The manager of the national team is not up to the standard of The club managers .

Who wins a ball in that team?

Unfortunately most nations have a style of football that has been accepted and sometimes modified by there club teams so they fit well when at intl level. We love the prem but its played totally differently to what we see on the intl seen (city and spurs excepted).

 

[Tashyboy]

Who wins a ball in that team?

Unfortunately most nations have a style of football that has been accepted and sometimes modified by there club teams so they fit well when at intl level. We love the prem but its played totally differently to what we see on the intl seen (city and spurs excepted).

This is where Dier can drop in, but he also drops in Henderson. You then get too many ball winners at the expense of creativity.

 

[Papas1982]

This is where Dier can drop in, but he also drops in Henderson. You then get too many ball winners at the expense of creativity.

I agree we play too safe at times. This qualifying group should have been a free run for a new era. But it has been as drab as the last decade.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

I don’t get this youth to PL question, as much as we hope the best players will come through at all levels, once you get to the top it’s dog eat dog.

The top PL teams haven’t got time to wait and see or hope for the best, Everton are a perfect example, we produced Englands greatest ever goalscorer and as soon as his head was turned, off he went.

Now were struggling after Lukaku, never replaced him, but we’ve got England U21 and U20 strikers at the club who aren’t ready, Koeman gave them a chance and lost his job.

Morata, Real Madrid Youth player, didn’t make it there, now performing at Chelsea, all clubs do it.

 

[Beezerk]

This is where Dier can drop in, but he also drops in Henderson. You then get too many ball winners at the expense of creativity.

You were doing so well, but then dropped the H bomb

 

[pbrown7582]

what gets forgotten 2010 the FA restructured the coaching philosophy launched the future game plan to encourage players from foundation phase starting out at 5 to be comfortable on the ball and not hoof it at the slightest hint of danger, these U17 players U9 then the fruit of a long term strategy coming through.

 

[rudebhoy]

Why do you say we fail so miserably at top end? Media controls the minds of everybody


We reach almost every major summer tournament.

Often get to last 16 or last 8.


Not really a failure, we are playing against every other great team in the world, only 1 can win each time.



Every country thinks their own country under performs etc

Since England started entering the WC, there have been 17 competitions. England have won it once (playing at home which gives a massive advantage), and reached one other semi final.

They have entered 14 European Championships, and have got to the semi final twice, 1968 and 1996 (again with home advantage).

1 final appearance (partly thanks to home advantage) in 31 tournaments is an abysmal record compared to Germany (14 appearances), Italy (9), France (5), Spain (5), Holland (4), Czech Republic (4) and Russia (4). Even Portugal have made more finals.

Considering the record of English clubs in European competitions, going back to when there were very few foreigners playing here, the national side has consistently massively underachieved.

Qualification is a formality these days given seedings and how soft groups are now, due to the massively increased number of places at finals. When was the last time England had a difficult group?

 

[Cherry13]

Since England started entering the WC, there have been 17 competitions. England have won it once (playing at home which gives a massive advantage), and reached one other semi final.

They have entered 14 European Championships, and have got to the semi final twice, 1968 and 1996 (again with home advantage).

1 final appearance (partly thanks to home advantage) in 31 tournaments is an abysmal record compared to Germany (14 appearances), Italy (9), France (5), Spain (5), Holland (4), Czech Republic (4) and Russia (4). Even Portugal have made more finals.

Considering the record of English clubs in European competitions, going back to when there were very few foreigners playing here, the national side has consistently massively underachieved.

Qualification is a formality these days given seedings and how soft groups are now, due to the massively increased number of places at finals. When was the last time England had a difficult group?

England have won 6 knockout games since 66.
Denmark, Ecuador, Spain, Cameroon, Paraguay, Belgium.

Spain was in 96 on penalties, other than that are any of them the classic big teams?

I think Englands level is qualification and lucky to get out of the group stages, then pray we don't get a big team.

The state of the national team is not helped by the premier league, but the premier league is not to blame.

IMO more youth players need to play abroad, whether it's for game time or just to learn different styles etc.

 

[Tashyboy]

You were doing so well, but then dropped the H bomb

Only stating what the football genius Southgate is doing.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Since England started entering the WC, there have been 17 competitions. England have won it once (playing at home which gives a massive advantage), and reached one other semi final.

They have entered 14 European Championships, and have got to the semi final twice, 1968 and 1996 (again with home advantage).

1 final appearance (partly thanks to home advantage) in 31 tournaments is an abysmal record compared to Germany (14 appearances), Italy (9), France (5), Spain (5), Holland (4), Czech Republic (4) and Russia (4). Even Portugal have made more finals.

Considering the record of English clubs in European competitions, going back to when there were very few foreigners playing here, the national side has consistently massively underachieved.

Qualification is a formality these days given seedings and how soft groups are now, due to the massively increased number of places at finals. When was the last time England had a difficult group?

Why have we massively underachieved? We have no divine right to do better, if we’ve faced better teams or deserve to lose, that’s football, were do we rank in world football?
We don’t choose our own groups, they are drawn and we can only play the teams we’re given.
Sometimes we just have to accept that we’re just not good enough.

 

[road2ruin]

Why have we massively underachieved? We have no divine right to do better, if we’ve faced better teams or deserve to lose, that’s football, were do we rank in world football?
We don’t choose our own groups, they are drawn and we can only play the teams we’re given.
Sometimes we just have to accept that we’re just not good enough.

I don't think it's necessarily the point at which England go out of the competitions that is the issue (not for me anyway as i'm pretty realistic of our chances) it's the manner in which we go out. We sail through qualification (albeit against even more mediocre opposition then England) and then save utterly dismal performances for the competition itself. I don't mean that we get humped by teams much better than us, I mean we struggle against teams of the level that we have been dispatching in the qualification rounds.

 

[Crazyface]

I watched the young lads yesterday and they were great. There's some real talent out there. They were incredibly comfy on the ball and could actually put ACCURATE passes together. The BIG difference between them and the duff seniors is that when they moved the ball forward, Jesus H, it was decisive and lightening fast.

PS The clown commentating (Sinclair I think it was), should learn when to keep his big stupid mouth shut, going on and on about how great Brazil, is, was and are. We totally outclassed them!!!!!!

 

[Deleted member 16999]

I don't think it's necessarily the point at which England go out of the competitions that is the issue (not for me anyway as i'm pretty realistic of our chances) it's the manner in which we go out. We sail through qualification (albeit against even more mediocre opposition then England) and then save utterly dismal performances for the competition itself. I don't mean that we get humped by teams much better than us, I mean we struggle against teams of the level that we have been dispatching in the qualification rounds.

Which I agree is a bigger problem, some of the tournaments we “failed” at, we went out on penalties, those teams were not better than us over 120 mins and penalties are a lottery, on another day etc the records may of looked a lot different.

We can only learn from the past and upto now we haven’t, hopefully in the future we can punch above our weight and do better, people get stick for talking about a clubs history then it’s ok to use it as a stick when it comes to England.