Deciding when is the right time to start shaping shots....

[Oddsocks]

Ok so with swing changes now clicking, good solid contact by my standard and the HC dropping at a good steady pace, ive now started thinking about taking on more adventurous shots.

A prime example is when pins are tuckek behind bunkers, instead of playing for the safe part of the green, im finding myself wanting to go for broke masters style!

Obvioulsy when you pull the shot off you get a mssive ego boost, but when you fail you ask yourself why did you try and take it on.

two good examples were in tuesdays twilight game.

Approach to a par 5 sitting at 145, pin tucked away to the right behind a bunker, pond to the left of the green, but realistically 30ft of safe green to aim for. went for glory and took the bunker shot on and left it 10 ft from the pin. 2 putted for a nice birdie just missing the eagle putt by being an inch short. whoooohoooo.

Next ego shot was on a 150y par 3, over water to an elevated green, pin tucked right close to the right of the green around 10ft from a bunker, but around 30-40ft of safe green to the left, which would leave a uphill putt. flirted with the bunker but just didnt bring it back enough, and left myself a right crap lie in the bunker, managed to get out in one and left it on the top of the bunker, chipped on a missed a 6ft'er uphill to scrape 5.

now as proved on the par 5 somethimes taking that shot on can pay off big time, especially given that the SI would effectively have meant i had a shot on the par 5, but also taking the shot on and failing as proved on the par 3 cost me 2 shots on a hole where the SI would give me no shots.

Is it simply a case of playing these shots in games that dont matter until your confident enough to be able to pull them off more often than not, or do you waiting until your 100% happy to play that shot before playing it.

 

[fundy]

Not totally sure that shaping shots and going for pins have to go together, theres no reason you need to shape a shot to go at a hidden pin from 150 yards unless your greens dont hold at all, and if they dont then i expect trying to shape the shot round is overly risky.

I like to think in these sort of situs my aim would be 10 ft to the middle of the green from the pin, in reality im a pin hunter who struggles not to go at almost every pin position I see lol.

 

[pokerjoke]

The shot to the par 5 sounds like a good risk worth taking,even though safely on the green for 2 would have left you a 30 foot putt for eagle,so that would have been how most players would have played it.As for the par 3 why would you take the bunker on,safely on the green take your 2 putt and off you go.Thats where course management comes into play,sometimes walking off with a good par is the sensible play.

 

[USER1999]

I like to think I always go for the pin. However, it doesn't often look like I do.

Not sure what this has to do with shaping the shot thoutgh.

 

[Oddsocks]

sorry i may have been a little unclear. on the par 5 i had two options,

Cut it into the pin (this was have made the lake a bit more of a hazzard had i not pulled it off, i opted to take the bunker on with a draw (natural shot shape) and bring it back in to the pin. My theory being if i got the cut in wrong it was going to end in a wet ball with a drop shot meaning on in 4, taking the bunker on and failing at worse would have left me on in 3. ok we all know the safe shot would have been a safe straight to the middle, but as teh game was with no pressure why not take a risk if nothing more than for a feel good factor.

Ref the par 3. the green all slopes right to left, now a cut into the pin would have taken the slope and bunker out of play, but as im still playing with soft cuts, it was safer to try and bring it in over the right hand bunker. if i had played for a cut and hit a straight one to the left of the green, with the slope on the green and a bank to the right sloping away from the green i would have eneded up un the cabbage.

Theres a couple of holes on my home track where they slightly dogleg right and im now experimenting with trying to cur it around the corner, and at the moment im working on a 50% success rate, the ones that cut around give me a very short approach to the green, the ones that dont and stay straight run on for about 40 yards to long and leave tricky second shots.

Im more curious as to what point did people start changing their game to attack the pins instead of playing for the safe part of the green, and also try shaping shots.

 

[Region3]

I'm guessing you mean that a left to right shot at the par 3 wouldn't fly over the bunker, and therefore would land safely on the green if it were short?

That only applies however if you don't overcook the amount of left to right.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but if I left a chip 6' away when I was only chipping from 10', I know what I'd be working on before shaping the ball.

 

[NWJocko]

Im more curious as to what point did people start changing their game to attack the pins instead of playing for the safe part of the green, and also try shaping shots.

I think there is a middle ground and, possibly, either of those mindsets alone may not do much good.

The good golfers (of which I do not claim to be one!) I'd imagine would do different things on different holes in the same round weighing up the risk and rewards of each.

Me, I aim at the flag and hope for the best!

 

[Region3]

Im more curious as to what point did people start changing their game to attack the pins instead of playing for the safe part of the green, and also try shaping shots.

I would have said more often than not it's the other way round. Certainly for me, when I started I used to go straight at every flag. The more I've improved, the more I've started to weigh up the options and now fire at less flags than I did before.

I'd hazard a guess that the really low guys would say knowing when to go at it and when to play safe is a big factor is scoring consistently low.

As for shaping shots, I never try to with approach shots. I sometimes do off the tee, but it doesn't always come off.

 

[bobmac]

Hold on. 145 yards for your second to a par 5?
If you're driving it that far it's only a flick with a wedge from 145?

 

[Imurg]

Get to that Par 5 one evening, on your own, and set down 10 balls.
Play the shot.
If you get 7 or more in a realistic Eagle/Birdie position then go for it on a regular basis - assuming everything else is right for the [****].
Any less than 7 and you're better off aiming for the heart of the green, you could still get a birdie from there.

 

[ScienceBoy]

I started to when my swing was at its best, I am making some changes to go even more consistent so I have not got back to shot shaping.

Changing from GI irons to my MP-57s has meant I can do it really easily on the range but it will be a while until I use it on the course UNLESS ABSOLUTLY NECESSARY!

 

[Oddsocks]

Hold on. 145 yards for your second to a par 5?
If you're driving it that far it's only a flick with a wedge from 145?

I wish bob, the yardage is 465/470, it was a creamed drive that finished just past the 150 markers to the green. Now with the lake being short left of the green im assuming the hole got is par based on a big percentage of players laying up. in the winter a drive would never roll out to 300/310, so you would never be left a 8iron to the pin. I played it in october last year and can remember a driver and a well hit hybrid finishing short. so working on the same distance tee position a drive of around 250, a 4h being around 180-190, and around a 20-30 yard pitch in.

 

[Oddsocks]

Get to that Par 5 one evening, on your own, and set down 10 balls.
Play the shot.
If you get 7 or more in a realistic Eagle/Birdie position then go for it on a regular basis - assuming everything else is right for the [****].
Any less than 7 and you're better off aiming for the heart of the green, you could still get a birdie from there.

interesting idea. i think the main thing is to assess whether shaping the shot is key, or consistent striking and distence management is better to know you can take shots on with hazzards that are more inplay so to speak. if a pin is tucked behind a bunker at 135, its got to be better to know that a full 9i, 3/4 8 iron and manage the distance, rather than trying shots such as cutting around the bunkers etc.

 

[EZprophet]

I never shape a shot unless I absolutely have to (if im in the trees etc..) The risk/reward for me of doing it just isnt worth it. Im no where near good enough to hit a fade consistently so for me going for that pin tucked on the right just isnt really an option unfortunately.

I would just aim it left of the pin (as close as possible to the pin but that still gives me some margin for error short/long and left/right...) maybe 5-10 yds left whetever it is, and then play it to that spot, hope I drain a 20-30 footer and if not then walk of with a par (well... thats the aim anyway!)

I think for a pro shaping shots can gain them a slight advantage on certain shots but tbh a lot of pros do just fine on tour with only one shot shape (Kaymer, Kenny Perry, Monty etc etc. )

I struggle enough hitting it straight so I dont try and shape the ball unless Im forced too.

 

[Mark_Aged_42]

145 yards is an 8 iron for me ( and a gap wedge for most forumites here ,I do know that!), but I thought it was really hard to shape the ball with anything under a 6 iron anyway? Happy to be corrected.

 

[EZprophet]

145 yards is an 8 iron for me ( and a gap wedge for most forumites here ,I do know that!), but I thought it was really hard to shape the ball with anything under a 6 iron anyway? Happy to be corrected.

The more lofted the club, the harder it is to shape it as theres more backspin imparted on it naturally. But you can shape any club, its just harder. Your cutoff for being able to shape it might be a 6 iron and for others it will be a different club.

Bubba Watson allegedly plays 30 yard hook shots with his sand wedge... on purpose.

 

[USER1999]

Bubba Watson allegedly plays 30 yard hook shots with his sand wedge... on purpose.

I think I did this at Woodhall Spa.

Not intentionally though.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

For me, the shot that finds the middle of every green is the right shape. Our greens aren't huge and if you can find the centre more often than not then you'll be having 15-25 at most for birdie. The problem comes when you go for broke miss it short side per se and then either don't get it out the bunker/rough trying to be too cute or blaze it over the back. A simple 5 at worse even with a three putt is now a 7 or 8.

 

[MashieNiblick]

I wouldn't think anyone other than a really good golfer, i.e cat 1, would worry about shaping a shot into a green just to get closer to a flag. Faldo was a master of this and I think he said that he could control the flight to move the ball a few yards either way. I don't think at club level we really need or could achieve that degree of control. The pros sometimes need to because of the nature of the greens they play to, especially at the majors, where being on the right level of the green or keeping below the hole is really important. For us, middle of the green isn't often going to leave you anything horrendous.

Off the tee however I reckon most players off 10 or so ought to be able to have a fair crack at shaping a driver. There's more scope to impart side spin with a lower lofted club so less touch or subtlety required to hit draw or fade and the target is much bigger anyway.

The danger is that the draw turns into a hook or the fade into a slice and puts you in the doo-doo or they turn into pushes or pulls and you end up in the opposite place to where you intended.

However, if there are holes that require a particular shape off the tee and you will gain a significant advantage I think it is worth practising this and going for it on the course.

Our 17th is a dogleg left that requires a draw if you want to hit driver and I learned to hit one just for that hole. Trouble is after hitting the previous 12 drives straight or with fades it often doesn't come off and I get a hook or push. That's when I wish I'd just hit an easy 3 wood.