Calls to cut prison population by half

Tashyboy

Tashyboy

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Eh, what you gonna do ask criminals to stop do er criminal stuff.

Theres cut backs in policing, cutbacks in prisons. Yet some numpty has called for cutting the prison population by half, incidentaly on the same day crime by over 65's is soaring.

I am all for seeing a reduction in the prison population but I am a massive believer that " actions speak louder than words".
 
There are ways in terms of giving early release, more community service rather than a prison sentence for minor offences. Longer term we have a ridiculously high re-offending rate. Why do they re-offend? How can we break the cycle? Simply locking people up is not working, although keeping the public safe is necessary and so I am not suggesting everyone should be freed. The US lock up and execute mountains of people, it doesn't stop crime. Same in China, Philippines etc.

There is no easy answer but for all of my lifetime govts have ploughed the same furrow and it has not worked. Maybe a different approach is required.
 
For many non violent crimes prison is probably not the best solution, depriving people of their freedom of movement by tagging is probably better as long as it can be managed effectively. Regarding the worst cases where people either deserve a harsher sentence or are not safe to be outside then I think the prison term needs to be more of a deterrent to re-offending. Maybe a system of hard labour where a degree of manual labour is tied to granting privileges. Just a thought.
 
We have an "Open" prison near us and hardly a week goes by when there isn't an announcement that a prisoner has absconded or not returned after a home visit! This is usually accompanied by a warning not to approach said absentee prisoner as they may be dangerous as they are serving time for murder or serious assault. :eek:
 
SocketRocket said:
depriving people of their freedom of movement by tagging is probably better as long as it can be managed effectively. Maybe a system of hard labour where a degree of manual labour is tied to granting privileges. Just a thought.
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Has Ozil got a tag, I just thought they were thick shinnies. :whoo:
 
Let the first couple of hundred out and put them within 200 yards of where these idiot MPs live. Then see how great an idea they think it is.
 
Make the sentences longer and harder as a deterrent, make them think twice before risking going to jail.
Just had a 32yr old scumbag sentenced to 30 months for assaulting an off duty Copper, this is his 251st conviction, yes that's correct 251.
 
pauldj42 said:
Make the sentences longer and harder as a deterrent, make them think twice before risking going to jail.
Just had a 32yr old scumbag sentenced to 30 months for assaulting an off duty Copper, this is his 251st conviction, yes that's correct 251.
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Sorry, don't agree. People like you describe here are basically beyond help, sending them down for 8 months instead of 4 months will have little or no effect and certainly won't deter anyone. They live/exist in the "here and now" and usually drift from one vodka/drugs fuelled binge to the next......no money, see something to nick, nick it, sell it, spend it on stuff....and repeat. They don't think about consequences, or care for that matter. How you deal with this element will always be a problem but they don't make up a large proportion of the population but do account for a disproportionate amount of crime.

A policy like the above is more along the lines of the US system.......just build bigger and bigger prisons. It doesn't work.

The only way to turn around the sort of case you refer to is to spend thousands on one to one counselling etc which just won't happen (probably rightly as the success rate would still be poor). A high number of the "beyond help" cases are a product of the care system. Not good kids that went off the rails but kids who never had any rails in the first place. That's where the money needs spending if you ask me. Good old root cause analysis in action.
 
Fyldewhite said:
Sorry, don't agree. People like you describe here are basically beyond help, sending them down for 8 months instead of 4 months will have little or no effect and certainly won't deter anyone. They live/exist in the "here and now" and usually drift from one vodka/drugs fuelled binge to the next......no money, see something to nick, nick it, sell it, spend it on stuff....and repeat. They don't think about consequences, or care for that matter. How you deal with this element will always be a problem but they don't make up a large proportion of the population but do account for a disproportionate amount of crime.

A policy like the above is more along the lines of the US system.......just build bigger and bigger prisons. It doesn't work.

The only way to turn around the sort of case you refer to is to spend thousands on one to one counselling etc which just won't happen (probably rightly as the success rate would still be poor). A high number of the "beyond help" cases are a product of the care system. Not good kids that went off the rails but kids who never had any rails in the first place. That's where the money needs spending if you ask me. Good old root cause analysis in action.
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Or just punish enough first time so he doesn't commit offence 2 never mind the next 250.

No doubt there are particular reasons why particular individuals go off the rails, but for 99%, imo, there isn't enough deterrent to stop them re-offending
 
Fyldewhite said:
Sorry, don't agree. People like you describe here are basically beyond help, sending them down for 8 months instead of 4 months will have little or no effect and certainly won't deter anyone. They live/exist in the "here and now" and usually drift from one vodka/drugs fuelled binge to the next......no money, see something to nick, nick it, sell it, spend it on stuff....and repeat. They don't think about consequences, or care for that matter. How you deal with this element will always be a problem but they don't make up a large proportion of the population but do account for a disproportionate amount of crime.

A policy like the above is more along the lines of the US system.......just build bigger and bigger prisons. It doesn't work.

The only way to turn around the sort of case you refer to is to spend thousands on one to one counselling etc which just won't happen (probably rightly as the success rate would still be poor). A high number of the "beyond help" cases are a product of the care system. Not good kids that went off the rails but kids who never had any rails in the first place. That's where the money needs spending if you ask me. Good old root cause analysis in action.
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Sorry but I think this namby pamby type of attitude is exactly the reason we have full prisons. Give out a punishment that fits the crime and people will think twice.
 
drive4show said:
Sorry but I think this namby pamby type of attitude is exactly the reason we have full prisons. Give out a punishment that fits the crime and people will think twice.
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Have you got anything at all to support that? We used to have a death penalty, and America still does. Do people still get murdered, yep. How do you give them more of a deterrent than the death penalty?
 
drive4show said:
Sorry but I think this namby pamby type of attitude is exactly the reason we have full prisons. Give out a punishment that fits the crime and people will think twice.
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Doesn't work in America, China or other equivalent hard sentencing country. If a death sentence or full term sentences don't work then you have to question whether deterrents really work.

I do agree that regular criminals need to be locked away for the sake of everyone else. I don't care about them at that point but I do care about their victims.
 
CheltenhamHacker said:
Have you got anything at all to support that? We used to have a death penalty, and America still does. Do people still get murdered, yep. How do you give them more of a deterrent than the death penalty?
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What have you got to support that liberal punishments work?
 
China uses a system of mediation. If someone beats you up then they pay for your hospital treatment and compensation out of their own pocket as opposed to 20 hours of community service which has no real effect.

If I got drunk in a pub and kicked off breaking a guy's jaw and had a bill for thousands to repair his teeth which meant my kids didn't have Xmas presents then I would certainly think twice about doing it again.
 
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