JARS
Hacker
Just read the rules article in this months GM regarding 'ball unplayable'. Would I be correct in thinking that: if I putted off the green I could deem the ball unplayable and place my ball back on the green, under penalty of course?
Ball Unplayable
- Thread starter JARS
- Start date
SwingsitlikeHogan
Major Champion
Yup. You can take stroke and distance at any time under any circumstances. I don't even think you have to declare your ball 'to be unplayable' - and of course it factually needed be unplayable. The point is - you are taking stroke and distance (which means going back to where you played your previous shot - and the taking back counts as a 'stroke', and the fact that you have to replay the shot is the 'distance' bit.
Good to remember if you putt off the green into such as a deep greenside bunker and end up with your ball up against the face of the bunker and a nightmare shot. Don't bother. Consider taking stroke and distance and put your ball back on the green where you putted from. But before you do it count the shots your likely to end taking, and compare with what's likely if you play intelligent and get yourself out of the situation you've put yourself in.
Last edited:
JARS
Hacker
Brilliant. Many thanks.
SwingsitlikeHogan
Major Champion
Here I meant - 'and of course it needn't actually be unplayable.
louise_a
Money List Winner
The only person who can deem a ball unplayable is the player themself.
CliveW
Tour Winner
Not true. Rule 28 states, "If the unplayable ball is in a bunker, the player may proceed under Clause a, b, or c. If he elects to proceed under Clause b or c, a ball must be dropped in the hazard."
Canary_Yellow
Journeyman Pro
The option to go back and play your shot from the location you played your previous shot always exists regardless of where your ball is now.
duncan mackie
Money List Winner
?
I think you need to read the rule rather than just quote it.....
He may proceed under clause a
Only if he proceeds under b or c must the ball be dropped on the bunker.
The discussion here is about clause a
Doon frae Troon
Ryder Cup Winner
Beat me to it.
Very common misused rule, my daughter once watched a county player player drop out of a bunker in the match in front of her.
PP never questioned it.
Can't remember how they resolved it as it was in a singles match.
CliveW
Tour Winner
Clause a relates to a ball lost or out of bounds. As the ball is in the bunker, it is neither lost nor out of bounds therefore clause a is irrelevant in this situation.
bluewolf
Money List Winner
AFAIK, Clause A has no stipulation. The only time a stipulation is mentioned is when the ball lies in a bunker and you proceed using Clause B or C, in which case the ball must be dropped in the bunker.
Canary_Yellow
Journeyman Pro
The rule simply says if the ball is unplayable you may do one of three things.
A ball can be unplayable anywhere on the course (except in a water hazard).
So it's entirely up to you if you want to proceed under 28a (stroke and distance).
A ball can be unplayable anywhere on the course (except in a water hazard).
So it's entirely up to you if you want to proceed under 28a (stroke and distance).
CliveW
Tour Winner
So what you are saying is that any time a ball is in a bunker, you can declare it unplayable and drop out of the bunker under penalty of one stroke no nearer the hole?
bluewolf
Money List Winner
You can declare a ball unplayable anywhere on the course, and proceed under any of the stipulated clauses..
Edit, with the exception of when the ball lies in a water hazard..
Edit 2 - In the example you mention, then if using clause B or C, then the ball must be dropped in the bunker. If using clause A, then you can drop it back where you played your last shot under penalty of 1 stroke..
Last edited:
Spuddy
Challenge Tour Pro
The Stroke and Distance provision of 27-1 is specifically 27-1a. The OOB and ball lost sections of 27-1 are 27-1b and 27-1c respectively so they are not relevant.
SwingsitlikeHogan
Major Champion
Including a bunker and regardless of where I was when I hit the ball into the bunker. The fact that I putted into the bunker and was on the green are irrelevant when I take S&D.
Fyldewhite
Tour Winner
No. He is saying that any time a ball is in a bunker you can declare it unplayable and drop it where you played your previous shot under penalty. Like Rule 28 (Unplayable ball) says.
Colin L
Tour Winner
That's not what he was saying, and not what anyone should say. Let me spell it out.
You decide to deem your ball unplayable. Wherever it lies, you have 3 choices of where to play your next stroke:
where you played your previous stroke (stroke and distance);
back on a line from the hole through where your ball lay;
within 2 club lengths of where your ball lay, not nearer the hole.
If your ball lies in a bunker, you can choose any of those places, but for the second and third choices you are restricted to dropping within the bunker. That means you cannot just drop outside the bunker with a penalty stroke.
The only way you can play from outside the bunker is the first choice - by playing from where you played your previous stroke. In the opening example of a ball putted into a bunker (been there, done it!), you can play from where you putted. That is your only possibility of playing from outside the bunker.
duncan mackie
Money List Winner
You correctly quoted rule 28 in your previous post which clearly states that clause a is an option - why are you now arguing (incorrectly) against the rule you quoted?
It really couldn't be clearer.
SwingsitlikeHogan
Major Champion
No - as bluewolf and others say - one of your options when in a bunker is to take S&D - nothing to do with your ball being unplayable - just a course management decision you can make. Other options when in a bunker are as described. And as stressed - it is in the opinion of the player alone whether a ball is unplayable, and when they would wish to declare it unplayable and take relief. As far as I am aware there are no definitions of the circumstances that determine that a ball is unplayable (though there are some that tell you that you cannot or must notplay it from where it lies e.g. in proximity (under the rules) to a staked tree from which relief is given.
Another scenario you might wish to use S&D is that you putt off the green and leave yourself a horrid and very difficult pitch off a bare lie. An option is to use S&D, put your ball back on the green , and have your putt again (you know the putt much better this time
)
