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guest100718
Guest
If a player hits a flag that has been removed and layed on the green when chipping from off the green is there any penalty?
rulefan
Tour Winner
If the flagstick had been left out of the hole by an earlier group say, then there is no penalty and the ball is played as it lies.
However, if it was taken out and laid down at the request of the player or with his knowledge, then loss of hole in matchplay or 2 strokes in stroke play.
However, if it was taken out and laid down at the request of the player or with his knowledge, then loss of hole in matchplay or 2 strokes in stroke play.
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guest100718
Guest
Cheers.
In 4 ball better ball, does loss of hole apply to the team or does it just mean the offender is out of the hole?
In 4 ball better ball, does loss of hole apply to the team or does it just mean the offender is out of the hole?
rulefan
Tour Winner
The offender is out of the hole..
Incidentally, the full decision is 17-3/3
Incidentally, the full decision is 17-3/3
Region3
Ryder Cup Winner
Also, if I remember right, the flagstick cannot be picked up if you hit a putt too hard and will hit the flagstick laying on the ground.
Foxholer
Blackballed
Used to be the case, but moving flagstick or any player's equipment while ball is in motion is allowed now (since 2012)- Rule 24.1b.
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bladeplayer
Money List Winner
Must admit i didnt know that ,
Foxholer
Blackballed
bladeplayer
Money List Winner
ah cheers mate was replying at the same time you posted , thanks .. luckily it didnt occur before the change tho because i still would have move the flag if im being honest ..
Region3
Ryder Cup Winner
I am the bloke that quotes the rules and sounds convincing, but is actually wrong.
Damn.
Good job the only time I've quoted it since it changed it was only me that suffered.
duncan mackie
Money List Winner
really?
I'm not going to go back and check exactly when this came into being, but I thought it's been that way since the 'New Code' rules in 1984.....at the risk of joining Gary in the corner
I hate not knowing.......1956.
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Foxholer
Blackballed
really?
I'm not going to go back and check exactly when this came into being, but I thought it's been that way since the 'New Code' rules in 1984.....at the risk of joining Gary in the corner
I hate not knowing.......1956.
Er 2008? (did think 2012 was too recent).
From 2000-04 rules 24-1
When a ball is in motion, an obstruction that might influence the movement of the ball, other than an attended flagstick or equipment of the players, must not be removed.
From 2008-12 rules 24-1
When a ball is in motion, an obstruction that might influence the movement of the ball, other than equipment of any player or the flagstick when attended, removed or held up, must not be moved.
Indeed, in '56 (a major re-vamp when 'Putting Green' was real and not just 20yards from the hole) it was OK. This could well have been a mistake/oversight as Penalty for Hitting removed Flagstick was reinstated in 1960 - 34-4a...
If a player's ball strike the flagstick when it is attended or has been removed or if it strike the person attending the flagstick or equipment carried by him, the player shall incur a penalty of :-
Match play - Loss of hole; Stroke play - Two strokes and the ball shall be played as it lies.
rulefan
Tour Winner
24-1b was changed in 2008 to include a 'removed' flagstick.
duncan mackie
Money List Winner
I think we are all agreeing now, and appreciating what we are agreeing too!
I admit I had read your post without the full context, despite having read the whole thread, hence the response, and had put a knowledge regarding the 2012 changes together with the wording used to completely miss the 'unattended element'... I'll join Gary
Colin L
Tour Winner
Region3
Ryder Cup Winner
Colin L
Tour Winner
Me.... in the naughty corner
Don't stay too long then. Any one of us might need space there at any time.
