Are bunkers too easy?

[CheltenhamHacker]

So, this isn’t a topic about the average bunker at the courses we play at. I’m focussing more on the absolutely perfect courses played on week in week out by the pros. Most times, a pro doesn’t mind going in a bunker (unless the sides are exceptionally high…), as they know they will get a consistent lie, plenty of sand, and a lot of the time, can chip it out pretty close to the pin. It feels to me, that they are actually getting a more consistent lie than on the fairway sometimes (chance of a divot?), and in the rough.

Should the bunkers not be more of a punishment, and return to being a “hazard” that should cost a shot? One way to do this would be to not allow the raking of bunkers. I don’t know either way, but were the original bunkers on courses ever raked, or were they left to act as a hazard?

Any thoughts?

 

[North Mimms]

If you're after unraked bunkers, come and play my course late on a saturday afternoon...

 

[garyinderry]

let the freak pro's get on with it. they don't play the same game as us!

 

[Duckster]

I'm sure I read somewhere that Pine Valley doesn't even have any rakes for their bunkers. If you end up in an old footprint, then it's just tough luck.

As for the current tour pro's, I think they prefer to be in a bunker round the green purely due to the rough being so flamin deep.

 

[pokerjoke]

I think you make a very valid point.
Bunkers should be a hazard where theres a very good chance you would take a shot more,
than you would if you were on the fairway or fringe.
The thing is a pro is a totally different specimen to the amateur,to us average players
it is a hazard and potentially a dropped shot.
Trouble is they cant all be pot bunkers with a 10ft vertical face.

 

[guest100718]

I'm sure I read somewhere that Pine Valley doesn't even have any rakes for their bunkers. If you end up in an old footprint, then it's just tough luck.

As for the current tour pro's, I think they prefer to be in a bunker round the green purely due to the rough being so flamin deep.

Theyd rather have a bunker shot and green to work with than a chip from the collar of rough to a tight pin.

 

[el marko]

Yes. The Wentworth bunkers were an absolute joke. Theyre meant to be a hazard - not a preferable option to the rough next to it!

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Deep pot bunkers off the tee seem to have disappeared from the average golf course. Designers now go for length instead.
I think it is a shame that brute strength is starting to come before skill.

 

[guest100718]

You do know that the pros spend a long time practising bunker shots.....

 

[patricks148]

no one would rather me in a bunker at my place, no matter who they are:rofl:

 

[Birchy]

Chipping it close from bunkers is a skilled shot, just because the pros are good at it doesn't mean its easy.

The best pros on tour are just a tad over 60% for sand saves so its hardly too easy.

 

[CheltenhamHacker]

You do know that the pros spend a long time practising bunker shots.....

I do, but logically, if they are guaranteed a nice lie in a soft bunker, this will be easier/more consistent than out of the rough next to it? Which therefore makes it preferable to end up in the bunker, which stops it acting as a "hazard", which was it's original intention. I imagine the first designed bunkers around greens were put in place to act as a deterrant to going for the green and missing, not to give the pros a perfect place to bail out to and end up with an easy chip.

Or do you not agree with that?

 

[CheltenhamHacker]

Chipping it close from bunkers is a skilled shot, just because the pros are good at it doesn't mean its easy.

The best pros on tour are just a tad over 60% for sand saves so its hardly too easy.

Hadn't seen that % before! Wonder if there is a % for greenside rough saves, they should be similar, otherwise this would suggest the bunkers are too easy....

 

[Deleted member 1147]

Nothing about going in a bunker is guaranteed.
They could get plugged, be on a downslope, be up against a lip, or if a bunker is wet the sand can become very heavy and change the shot entirely.

The main thing is that spin is easier to achieve from a good lie in the bunker than from the rough.

 

[HawkeyeMS]

yes, I remember a few years ago Nicklaus having every other tooth taken out of the rakes at the memorial to create a less smoothe surface, the pros hated it!

 

[Birchy]

Hadn't seen that % before! Wonder if there is a % for greenside rough saves, they should be similar, otherwise this would suggest the bunkers are too easy....

The leader in scrambling from the rough is at 71% so looking at the general rough compared to bunker stats it shows that bunkers aren't actually that easy

Like anything your in the lap of the gods with the variables. You can sometimes get nice/bad lies etc wherever you hit it.

 

[guest100718]

for tour pros there are certainly times when a bunker shot may be esier than a chip from the rough, but I'd think theyd rather not be in a buniker.

 

[londonlewis]

The Golf shown on the TV on the PGA tour is difficult to judge as they don't like to show the professionals looking foolish. So often we only see the best shots.
Think back to when McDowell won the US Open. Dustin Johnson was leading the tournament going into the final round. We saw him play the first 2-3 holes and then nothing from then on. Because Dustin was playing poorly.

do we therefore only see the best shots played, which gives us an impaired view of how easy / hard bunkers actually are?

just a thought

 

[Roops]

You have to remember that tour events have prescribed guidelines for the preparation of bunkers. I think it is 3/4" of sand on top of the firm base. So the pro's should have a pretty good idea of what they are faced with in the bunker. Plus, they have had a practice round to check the ground conditions. Also, most caddies seem to take particular care to restore the bunker to it's previous best after their "employer" has paid a visit to one. I guess this helps with their ability to play consistently good bunker shots. I know on a well maintained course I think I would rather be in the bunker than the green side rough, even on a wet day.

 

[Deleted member 1147]

...do we therefore only see the best shots played, which gives us an impaired view of how easy / hard bunkers actually are?

just a thought

I'd suggest that's the case for the whole game. People often seem to think that all tour pro's hit 100yd wedges to within 10 ft every time, hole massive putts for fun and hit the ball miles. The average tour player is not what we see when watching Sky's coverage.

Scroll down the PGA tour stat's and have a look at those in say 100th place for each stat - probably not quite so impressive as the top 50 players we see week in week out!