Animal Holes

Joined
Jul 31, 2015
Messages
1,690
In my opinion based on the photo alone....none of them are animal holes/scrapings.

I may form a different opinion if I saw them in the flesh but as it stands I'd probably laugh if someone asked for relief!!
 
Thread starter #3
Joined
Nov 11, 2015
Messages
103
Location
Sale
At the time it didnt cross my mind and I just played my shot but afterwards I thought had my ball been 2 inches further it would of been directly below the grass. Further than that unplayable.
 

rulie

Head Pro
Joined
Sep 2, 2015
Messages
1,127
Here's a query. We carry sand bottles on our course to fill divot holes and many members are, fortunately, very diligent about doing this. In the fall (as now) we have Canada geese frequenting the course. They tend to get into the sand-filled divot holes with their beaks, looking for whatever. If my ball were to come to rest in a sand-filled divot hole that was initially level with the ground surface but had been disturbed by a goose, looking for whatever and leaving a hole in the sand, would I be entitled to free relief for a ball in an animal hole? Sorry that I don't have any photos, but, imo, it is very clear that the geese have made holes in the sand that is filling the divot hole.
 

Crow

Crow Person
Joined
Nov 14, 2010
Messages
7,000
Location
Leicestershire
I don't know if it changed in the last rules update but I understood that holes had to be created by burrowing animals, geese are not so I'd say no relief.
 

Colin L

Tour Winner
Joined
May 26, 2012
Messages
4,278
Location
Edinburgh
Here's a query. We carry sand bottles on our course to fill divot holes and many members are, fortunately, very diligent about doing this. In the fall (as now) we have Canada geese frequenting the course. They tend to get into the sand-filled divot holes with their beaks, looking for whatever. If my ball were to come to rest in a sand-filled divot hole that was initially level with the ground surface but had been disturbed by a goose, looking for whatever and leaving a hole in the sand, would I be entitled to free relief for a ball in an animal hole? Sorry that I don't have any photos, but, imo, it is very clear that the geese have made holes in the sand that is filling the divot hole.
First thought is no, that's just a mess made by the bird akin to footprints, not a hole as such, but it bears thinking about a bit more. It makes me think that when crows, as they do, lift replaced divots looking for food, is the exposed divot hole made by an animal? (That's not really a serious thought.)
 

jim8flog

Journeyman Pro
Joined
May 20, 2017
Messages
10,476
Location
Yeovil
I cannot see animal holes the ones on the the right and left looks like the sand has just collapsed when somebody has stepped just below it.
 

salfordlad

Active member
Joined
Dec 16, 2020
Messages
159
Here's a query. We carry sand bottles on our course to fill divot holes and many members are, fortunately, very diligent about doing this. In the fall (as now) we have Canada geese frequenting the course. They tend to get into the sand-filled divot holes with their beaks, looking for whatever. If my ball were to come to rest in a sand-filled divot hole that was initially level with the ground surface but had been disturbed by a goose, looking for whatever and leaving a hole in the sand, would I be entitled to free relief for a ball in an animal hole? Sorry that I don't have any photos, but, imo, it is very clear that the geese have made holes in the sand that is filling the divot hole.
I have no difficulty or reservations about calling that a hole made by an animal, ground torn up by animals is precisely what 16.1 is intended to cover. It also is clearly not an issue excluded from relief by the "no relief for isolated animal footprints" interpretation. So, IMO, go for it. There could be merit, in the interests of having everyone on the same page, of posting a confirming local rule. (Everyone being defined as those that bother to read the local rules, of course. I'm not so sympathetic to those that don't bother.)
 
Joined
Mar 3, 2008
Messages
5,336
Location
sarf Lunnon
Here's a query. We carry sand bottles on our course to fill divot holes and many members are, fortunately, very diligent about doing this. In the fall (as now) we have Canada geese frequenting the course. They tend to get into the sand-filled divot holes with their beaks, looking for whatever. If my ball were to come to rest in a sand-filled divot hole that was initially level with the ground surface but had been disturbed by a goose, looking for whatever and leaving a hole in the sand, would I be entitled to free relief for a ball in an animal hole? Sorry that I don't have any photos, but, imo, it is very clear that the geese have made holes in the sand that is filling the divot hole.
The hole was made by a golfer, was it not? All the goose has done is make the filling uneven. Ergo not an animal hole. (Discuss using both sides of the paper ... :) )
 

salfordlad

Active member
Joined
Dec 16, 2020
Messages
159
The hole was made by a golfer, was it not? All the goose has done is make the filling uneven. Ergo not an animal hole. (Discuss using both sides of the paper ... :) )
By that logic, you get no relief from a divot in GUR because the divot was made by a golfer. Your relief is from a defined abnormal course condition, not from the divot. You get the relief anywhere on the course other than in a penalty area. Divots also tend to be all over the course but they do not change any entitlement to authorised relief.
 

Swinglowandslow

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 19, 2018
Messages
2,157
The hole was made by a golfer, was it not? All the goose has done is make the filling uneven. Ergo not an animal hole. (Discuss using both sides of the paper ... :) )
The hole was repaired so that it was no longer a hole. Then, an animal changed the nature of that non-hole into a condition covered by the rule.😀
 
Top