KeefG
Journeyman Pro
Guys, can someone explain in layman's terms what the rule changes regarding grooves are and what the difference is its going to make?
2010 Rule Changes - Grooves
- Thread starter KeefG
- Start date
TonyN
Money List Winner
Basically Keef from what I understand, they are limiting the depth and shape ( getting rid of U shaped grooves) so the ball does not grip as much and spins less.
I think the emphasis is based purely on pros being able to spin the ball silly amounts even from the rough.
The rough being a penal place for misplaced drives offer little in the way of a challenge to the likes of Woods, Mickelson etc.
I think the emphasis is based purely on pros being able to spin the ball silly amounts even from the rough.
The rough being a penal place for misplaced drives offer little in the way of a challenge to the likes of Woods, Mickelson etc.
Tommo21
Tour Winner
Can someone confirm? If, like me, you have the current model of irons and wedges with the grooves we’re playing right now, that you can still continue using them for the foreseeable future. In other words it’s new production that will need to change and slowly filter into the system as each of us replace our gear?
I know the pros will need to adhere to this, but what will it mean to us club golfers.
I know the pros will need to adhere to this, but what will it mean to us club golfers.
TonyN
Money List Winner
Sorry Tommo I cant confirm, but I do think that the new rules wont come into affect for club golfers untill about 2014. I may be wrong.
forefortheday
Tour Rookie
It's 2024 for us mere mortals so I think we'll have new clubs by then.
Mind you what would you feel like playing against a guy who has the old grooves and you have the new style ones?
USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
They will be so worn by then it won't matter much. I find that the newness wears off (along with some of the spin) in about a year, maybe less.
Hello there,
Sorry for the slightly lenghty reply, but the below is lifted straight out of an interview I did with Peter Dawson of the R&A in last year's November issue. Should explain all the various timings involved
Turning to equipment rules, could you just summarise the new groove regulations recently announced?
Let’s just go back a step or two. What we’d found – and this has been a long collaborative research programme between the R&A and the USGA – was that from the fairway or a lie where the grass isn’t getting between clubhead and ball, it doesn’t matter what your groove configuration is, you’ll still get about the same amount of spin on your iron shots - even if you have no grooves. However, in the rough when grass gets between club and ball, modern groove configurations, combined with modern golf balls can generate as much, or in some cases, even more spin than from the fairway. That is clearly undesirable as it tends to make accurate driving less important. So we felt a new regulation was needed which limits both the cross-sectional volume of a groove and the sharpness of its edge in clubs with 25 degrees of loft or more. You’ll still get full spin from the fairway where it doesn’t matter what the grooves are like, but your spin capabilities from the rough are considerably reduced.
There are different lead times for different standards of player, aren’t there?
We feel this is very important at elite levels, so we’re talking about introducing this as a condition of competition on the top pro tours from January 1 2010, coming in four years later at lesser pro events and top amateur events. But to the average golfer we’ve given the guarantee that this will not be reconsidered before 2020 for implementation in 2024 at the very earliest, if ever. So any clubs you own or purchase between now and January 1 2010 (after which all clubs must be made to the new specs) you’ll be able to use for a good period of time. We think the formula we’ve come up with will, on the one hand, do what we want to do for the game, and on the other, still give average golfers plenty of use out of their existing club investments.
Can you quantify what effect this will have on spin?
You’ll get roughly half as much spin from the rough as you do from the fairway. But it will depend on the grass, the lie and how you hit the ball. I think we are going to see the return of the “flier†to a degree, and it will also be interesting to see if the ball manufacturers decide to try and do something different.
Hope this helps
Sorry for the slightly lenghty reply, but the below is lifted straight out of an interview I did with Peter Dawson of the R&A in last year's November issue. Should explain all the various timings involved
Turning to equipment rules, could you just summarise the new groove regulations recently announced?
Let’s just go back a step or two. What we’d found – and this has been a long collaborative research programme between the R&A and the USGA – was that from the fairway or a lie where the grass isn’t getting between clubhead and ball, it doesn’t matter what your groove configuration is, you’ll still get about the same amount of spin on your iron shots - even if you have no grooves. However, in the rough when grass gets between club and ball, modern groove configurations, combined with modern golf balls can generate as much, or in some cases, even more spin than from the fairway. That is clearly undesirable as it tends to make accurate driving less important. So we felt a new regulation was needed which limits both the cross-sectional volume of a groove and the sharpness of its edge in clubs with 25 degrees of loft or more. You’ll still get full spin from the fairway where it doesn’t matter what the grooves are like, but your spin capabilities from the rough are considerably reduced.
There are different lead times for different standards of player, aren’t there?
We feel this is very important at elite levels, so we’re talking about introducing this as a condition of competition on the top pro tours from January 1 2010, coming in four years later at lesser pro events and top amateur events. But to the average golfer we’ve given the guarantee that this will not be reconsidered before 2020 for implementation in 2024 at the very earliest, if ever. So any clubs you own or purchase between now and January 1 2010 (after which all clubs must be made to the new specs) you’ll be able to use for a good period of time. We think the formula we’ve come up with will, on the one hand, do what we want to do for the game, and on the other, still give average golfers plenty of use out of their existing club investments.
Can you quantify what effect this will have on spin?
You’ll get roughly half as much spin from the rough as you do from the fairway. But it will depend on the grass, the lie and how you hit the ball. I think we are going to see the return of the “flier†to a degree, and it will also be interesting to see if the ball manufacturers decide to try and do something different.
Hope this helps
Tommo21
Tour Winner
Good man Jezz.
KeefG
Journeyman Pro
Cheers folks!
HogansAlley
Assistant Pro
A great rule change this for the professional game. It has been getting to a situation where being in the rough is no worse than in the fairway for some. Tiger Woods' approach to the 18th at the US Open last year (great as it was) would not have possible a few years ago. There has to be a penalty for being crooked off the tee, it might stop courses from having to be lengthed too much. You never, know top pro's may even start wanting a softer ball too! As for the rest of us, I suspect we shall barely notice the difference as we don't achieve sufficent clubhead speed to feel the true benefit.
toonarmy
Q-School Graduate
I've said it before and I'll keep saying it until I'm proved wrong - I think Woods (in particular) is seriously comprimised when this comes in...unless he learns how to hit fairways 
theeaglehunter
Tour Winner
I am definitely going to buy some of the current groove style wedges before the end of the year. (As of 2010 manufactures will only be producing new style grooves as far as I am aware) I need all the help I can get checking the ball from the rough!
Maybe I should buy 10 sets of wedges to last me a good while when some get worn out
Maybe I should buy 10 sets of wedges to last me a good while when some get worn out
Dave3498
Q-School Graduate
Backspin? It's never happened to me, even by accident, nor to most of the mid-handicap golfers I play with. So what's the big deal?
USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
I view it as a plague. I either get loads, or none. On occasion 20 ft of screw back is not out of the question, and a similar shot can roll off the back. No idea why, I am just hopelessly inconsistent.
Imurg
The Grinder Of Pars (Semi Crocked)
And lets face it most of us end up short of the flag more often than not so what the hell do we need backspin for?
HTL
Tour Winner
Same as Murph with regard to backspin. I have recently started to get loads when not needed and none when needed.
Last time I played with Smiffy it happend a few times. Its not needed but it does look ace!
Last time I played with Smiffy it happend a few times. Its not needed but it does look ace!
theeaglehunter
Tour Winner
I don't like backspin at all- it's far too difficult to judge. With my wedges I usually get enough spin for them to stop dead or within a foot of the pitch mark and this allows me to really attack the flag. The only trouble is in the winter because I also have a naturally high ball flight, balls end up plugging on the green and it's a pain to repair pitchmarks 3/4 of the depth of the ball! Even if i could consistently get backspin I would find it too hard to judge- as do the pros. how many times do you see spin hurting them from within 100 yards?
viscount17
Money List Winner
and this rule change is to limit the pros from the rough?
I didn't realise they had any; their rough is our first cut!
and as for bunkers . . .
I didn't realise they had any; their rough is our first cut!
and as for bunkers . . .
