JustOne
Ryder Cup Winner
Am I right in thinking that if you have 15 clubs in your bag before you play then you can nominate one that you won't use? It's really not necessary to remove it and trudge all the way back to the car with it?
15 clubs?
- Thread starter JustOne
- Start date
B
birdieman
Guest
I'm sure that's correct.
USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
I believe this to be so.
Why have you dropped the UK from your name?
Why have you dropped the UK from your name?
JustOne
Ryder Cup Winner
It was a fleeting moment of madness, and KNOB wasn't available
p1pete
Club Champion
Looking at my new iPhone app 
Rule 4 States: The player must not start a stipulated round with more than fourteen clubs. He is limited to the clubs thus selected for that round.....blah blah
Penalties are then listed depending on the type of comp being played.
No mention of nominating the clubs they will/will not use but keeping them in the bag.....so would assume the answer is NO
Rule 4 States: The player must not start a stipulated round with more than fourteen clubs. He is limited to the clubs thus selected for that round.....blah blah
Penalties are then listed depending on the type of comp being played.
No mention of nominating the clubs they will/will not use but keeping them in the bag.....so would assume the answer is NO
USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
But unless you are in an open or something important, surely it would be churlish if your opponent/playing partners made you take one back to the car park.
p1pete
Club Champion
Hang on.....it then talks about Declaring clubs out of play
"Any club or clubs carried or used in breach of rule....must be declared out of play by the player to his opponent in match play or his fellow competitor in stroke play immediately upon discovery of the breach. The player must not use the club or clubs for the remainder of the stipulated round".....so the answer is YES
Helps if you read the entire thing
"Any club or clubs carried or used in breach of rule....must be declared out of play by the player to his opponent in match play or his fellow competitor in stroke play immediately upon discovery of the breach. The player must not use the club or clubs for the remainder of the stipulated round".....so the answer is YES
Helps if you read the entire thing
The_LHC
Head Pro
Looking at my new iPhone app
Rule 4 States: The player must not start a stipulated round with more than fourteen clubs. He is limited to the clubs thus selected for that round.....blah blah
Penalties are then listed depending on the type of comp being played.
No mention of nominating the clubs they will/will not use but keeping them in the bag.....so would assume the answer is NO
Unless that's a recent rule change it's wrong, you can declare a club as not in play, as long as you do it before the match is underway. If you subsequently use the club then it's a penalty obviously.
The_LHC
Head Pro
Yeah it's 4-4c Excess club declared out of play. It doesn't say anything about declaring it out of play before the round, only once the breach has been discovered but I don't see any reason why if you "discover the breach" before play begins that you can't declare it there and then.
The_LHC
Head Pro
Oooh in fact that would be wrong, Decision 4-4c/1 it is not permitted to start a round with more than 14 clubs, there is no provision in the Rules to declare a club out of play prior to the round beginning.
Interesting...
Interesting...
The_LHC
Head Pro
This is the exact text of the decision:
Q. Before the start of a round, a player discovers that there are 15 clubs in his golf bag. He declares one of the clubs out of play, removes it from his bag, places it on the floor of his golf cart and begins the round. Is the player subject to penalty?
A. Yes, for starting the round with more than 14 clubs. Rule 4-4c has to do with declaring an excess club out of play on discovery of a breach after a round has started. There is nothing in the Rules to permit carrying, during a round, an excess club declared out of play before the round.
Q. Before the start of a round, a player discovers that there are 15 clubs in his golf bag. He declares one of the clubs out of play, removes it from his bag, places it on the floor of his golf cart and begins the round. Is the player subject to penalty?
A. Yes, for starting the round with more than 14 clubs. Rule 4-4c has to do with declaring an excess club out of play on discovery of a breach after a round has started. There is nothing in the Rules to permit carrying, during a round, an excess club declared out of play before the round.
rickg
Money List Winner
Sorry but that's a misconception. You are not allowed 15 clubs even if you declare one of them out of play before you start the round.
Here's the R&A decision which demonstrates: (4-4c/1)
Q. Before the start of a round, a player discovers that there are 15 clubs in his golf bag. He declares one of the clubs out of play, removes it from his bag, places it on the floor of his golf cart and begins the round. Is the player subject to penalty?
A. Yes, for starting the round with more than 14 clubs. Rule 4-4c has to do with declaring an excess club out of play on discovery of a breach after a round has started. There is nothing in the Rules to permit carrying, during a round, an excess club declared out of play before the round.
rickg
Money List Winner
OOPS!! I posted at the same time as you with the same ruling. 
The_LHC
Head Pro
There's a bit of a contradiction here though:
4-4a/11 Excess Club Discovered Before Player Plays from 2nd Tee But After Opponent or Fellow-Competitor Has Played
Q A player starts a round with 15 clubs. He discovers his error at the 2nd tee after his opponent or a fellow-competitor has played but before he has played. Does the player incur the maximum penalty of (a) deduction of two holes in match play or (b) four strokes in stroke play?
A No. Since the player has not started play of the 2nd hole, he incurs a penalty of (a) deduction of one hole in match play or (b) two strokes in stroke play.
So that implies that you're only penalised for the holes you've actually started. However doesn't that mean that, provided you don't tee off first on the 1st tee, you can wait for your opponent or partner to tee off, so the "round" is underway, then "discover" the extra club and declare it out of play for no penalty (You haven't started play on the 1st, so you can't be penalised for that).
Problem here is 4-4c/1 uses the word "round" but there's no definition of "Round" that I can find in the rules, so it's not clear whether that applies to each individual golfer or the group as a whole (ie is the "round" under way when ONE player has teed off or is each player's round treated indivdually?).
4-4a/11 Excess Club Discovered Before Player Plays from 2nd Tee But After Opponent or Fellow-Competitor Has Played
Q A player starts a round with 15 clubs. He discovers his error at the 2nd tee after his opponent or a fellow-competitor has played but before he has played. Does the player incur the maximum penalty of (a) deduction of two holes in match play or (b) four strokes in stroke play?
A No. Since the player has not started play of the 2nd hole, he incurs a penalty of (a) deduction of one hole in match play or (b) two strokes in stroke play.
So that implies that you're only penalised for the holes you've actually started. However doesn't that mean that, provided you don't tee off first on the 1st tee, you can wait for your opponent or partner to tee off, so the "round" is underway, then "discover" the extra club and declare it out of play for no penalty (You haven't started play on the 1st, so you can't be penalised for that).
Problem here is 4-4c/1 uses the word "round" but there's no definition of "Round" that I can find in the rules, so it's not clear whether that applies to each individual golfer or the group as a whole (ie is the "round" under way when ONE player has teed off or is each player's round treated indivdually?).
Tommo21
Tour Winner
If it's before you play, as you said, why not take it out.....If you're ready to tee off then give it to someone who'll take it to the pro shop or to their car.........
Smiffy
Grand Slam Winner
Bloody hell James.
Your car wasn't that far away
Your car wasn't that far away
USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
Put your club in our pro shop and the b. will sell it before you get back.
daymond
Tour Rookie
Following from Tommo's post give it to your opponent. Play one hole and do him for carrying an extra club. I don't believe I've just said that. A slap on the wrist is in order!!!
HomerJSimpson
Hall of Famer
Can Jezz our resident rules guru give us a definitive answer?
Region3
Ryder Cup Winner
Off on a slight tangent, but I read the rules a few weeks ago and was surprised to read that if you're playing a pairs comp, you can use your partners clubs.
Unless I'm misunderstanding it, that means if he only uses 13 you can give him your 15th club and use it whenever you want.
Unless I'm misunderstanding it, that means if he only uses 13 you can give him your 15th club and use it whenever you want.
